In effect by defending Bush Johnny is claiming he caused this transition.

agnerd said:

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Guess I'm the only one that doesn't think he should get it back. He broke the rules, he knew he broke the rules, he decided it was worth the risk of getting caught, he got caught, and then thinks the consequences shouldn't apply to him.

I didn't meet the lofty GPA requirements of one of my college scholarships. I guess I need to start a PR campaign on how I DESERVE to have that scholarship money given to me even though I didn't hold up my end of the bargain.

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This, slap in the face to all the athletes who did follow the rules.

Know Your Enemy said:

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AnimalA10 said:

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agnerd said:

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Guess I'm the only one that doesn't think he should get it back. He broke the rules, he knew he broke the rules, he decided it was worth the risk of getting caught, he got caught, and then thinks the consequences shouldn't apply to him.

I didn't meet the lofty GPA requirements of one of my college scholarships. I guess I need to start a PR campaign on how I DESERVE to have that scholarship money given to me even though I didn't hold up my end of the bargain.

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This, slap in the face to all the athletes who did follow the rules.

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Just because they didn't get caught doesn't mean they followed the rules. Are you guys really this dumb or are you trolling?

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Exactly. I think you would be hard pressed to find one who followed the rules if you could look closely enough.

agnerd said:

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Guess I'm the only one that doesn't think he should get it back. He broke the rules, he knew he broke the rules, he decided it was worth the risk of getting caught, he got caught, and then thinks the consequences shouldn't apply to him.

I didn't meet the lofty GPA requirements of one of my college scholarships. I guess I need to start a PR campaign on how I DESERVE to have that scholarship money given to me even though I didn't hold up my end of the bargain.

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Everyone acknowledges that the practice of players receiving benefits was extremely widespread. By your logic, you would have to collect thousands of trophies. The fact that the prohibition of players from receiving benefits was illegal in the first place also helps.

Oh, so taking money from people is ok even in retrospect? Hang the banner - Texas Aggies Undefeated 1994 National Champs!

Know Your Enemy said:

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agnerd said:

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Guess I'm the only one that doesn't think he should get it back. He broke the rules, he knew he broke the rules, he decided it was worth the risk of getting caught, he got caught, and then thinks the consequences shouldn't apply to him.

I didn't meet the lofty GPA requirements of one of my college scholarships. I guess I need to start a PR campaign on how I DESERVE to have that scholarship money given to me even though I didn't hold up my end of the bargain.

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So you think Johnny's Heisman should be taken away too?

And your comparison is absolute dog **** by the way.

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If Johnny had been caught, yes his trophy should've been taken away, too. He decided that the money was more important to him than the chance he could lose the trophy. I will argue all day that he EARNED the right to make the decision on whether the risk was acceptable to him. Same thing with Bush.

Accordingly, I knew that I had to keep a 3.75 to keep my scholarship. I knew that that would be difficult in engineering. I decided that an engineering degree was worth more to me than $7k of scholarship money. After a semester, I decided that being involved in campus life was more important than the $6k remaining on my scholarship. I chose to let me grades fall, and I had to deal with the consequences of those actions. I don't deserve the rest of that scholarship and nobody should feel sorry for me and the decisions I consciously made to lose it.

Both decisions involve evaluating the consequences of the actions taken. I guess I didn't try to cheat to keep my reward even though other people were. If I had cheated and gotten caught, again, I believe I deserve to lose my scholarship based on the rules I agreed to. But other than that, the situations seem very similar to me.

Why would anyone get upset at Reggie getting it returned? If the other candidates that year, felt he deserves it or they didn't make a fuss about it? Why would you individually care? It wasn't a performance enhancing act and he wasn't cheating on the field.

Enough pressure was made on the committee from past winners and other candidates. I'll take their input on this over most.

Yes. I drive a few miles over the speed limit most of the time.

agnerd said:

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Guess I'm the only one that doesn't think he should get it back. He broke the rules, he knew he broke the rules, he decided it was worth the risk of getting caught, he got caught, and then thinks the consequences shouldn't apply to him.

I didn't meet the lofty GPA requirements of one of my college scholarships. I guess I need to start a PR campaign on how I DESERVE to have that scholarship money given to me even though I didn't hold up my end of the bargain.

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If somebody in California smoked a joint and got put in state prison for five years, and California legalized marijuana one month after the five year prison sentence started, do you think that person should still serve the entire five years for something that is not illegal?

If a slave in the southern United States broke the law by running away in 1963 and was put in prison for life, and slavery was outlawed in 1964 (all of this actually happened by the way), do you think that person should still serve a life sentence in prison? He broke the rules, right? He knew the rules and decided it was worth the risk, and he got caught, right?

Hint: the only appropriate answer to these questions is "no." If your answer is anything other than "no" then you are bat **** crazy and there is no reasoning with you.

agnerd said:

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Know Your Enemy said:

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agnerd said:

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Guess I'm the only one that doesn't think he should get it back. He broke the rules, he knew he broke the rules, he decided it was worth the risk of getting caught, he got caught, and then thinks the consequences shouldn't apply to him.

I didn't meet the lofty GPA requirements of one of my college scholarships. I guess I need to start a PR campaign on how I DESERVE to have that scholarship money given to me even though I didn't hold up my end of the bargain.

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So you think Johnny's Heisman should be taken away too?

And your comparison is absolute dog **** by the way.

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If Johnny had been caught, yes his trophy should've been taken away, too. He decided that the money was more important to him than the chance he could lose the trophy. I will argue all day that he EARNED the right to make the decision on whether the risk was acceptable to him. Same thing with Bush.

Accordingly, I knew that I had to keep a 3.75 to keep my scholarship. I knew that that would be difficult in engineering. I decided that an engineering degree was worth more to me than $7k of scholarship money. After a semester, I decided that being involved in campus life was more important than the $6k remaining on my scholarship. I chose to let me grades fall, and I had to deal with the consequences of those actions. I don't deserve the rest of that scholarship and nobody should feel sorry for me and the decisions I consciously made to lose it.

Both decisions involve evaluating the consequences of the actions taken. I guess I didn't try to cheat to keep my reward even though other people were. If I had cheated and gotten caught, again, I believe I deserve to lose my scholarship based on the rules I agreed to. But other than that, the situations seem very similar to me.

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What a stupid comparison. Nothing about you having to keep a 3.75 GPA to maintain a scholarship is equivalent to Reggie Bush being eternally denied a Heisman trophy he rightfully won even though what he did is now totally legal. Your level of irrational butthurt over this is astounding.

Ag_0112358132134 said:

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If a slave in the southern United States broke the law by running away in 1964 and was put in prison for life, and slavery was outlawed in 1965 (this actually happened by the way), do you think that person should still serve a life sentence in prison? He broke the rules, right? He knew the rules and decided it was worth the risk, and he got caught, right?

Hint: the only appropriate answer to these questions is "no." If your answer is anything other than "no" then you are bat **** crazy and there is no reasoning with you.

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Slavery had been totally outlawed by 1964.

Yeah, I got the dates wrong. There was a slave who received a life sentence the year before slavery was outlawed. The point stands.

Right decision

now please posthumously strip OJ Simpson's

Scientific said:

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Why would anyone get upset at Reggie getting it returned? If the other candidates that year, felt he deserves it or they didn't make a fuss about it? Why would you individually care? It wasn't a performance enhancing act and he wasn't cheating on the field.

Enough pressure was made on the committee from past winners and other candidates. I'll take their input on this over most.

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This is the biggest point really. Not an issue with doing something on the field so who cares now. I get suspending it then (even if it was dumb), but there is no reason to uphold a punishment as rules change. As someone else mentioned, it's like putting someone in prison for 5 years for weed possession, legalizing weed a month later, and then keeping that guy in prison for 5 years anyway.

The Dog Lord said:

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Scientific said:

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Why would anyone get upset at Reggie getting it returned? If the other candidates that year, felt he deserves it or they didn't make a fuss about it? Why would you individually care? It wasn't a performance enhancing act and he wasn't cheating on the field.

Enough pressure was made on the committee from past winners and other candidates. I'll take their input on this over most.

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This is the biggest point really. Not an issue with doing something on the field so who cares now. I get suspending it then (even if it was dumb), but there is no reason to uphold a punishment as rules change. As someone else mentioned, it's like putting someone in prison for 5 years for weed possession, legalizing weed a month later, and then keeping that guy in prison for 5 years anyway.

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yep.

it isn't like he was caught taking PED's to enhance his performance.

Thank you Johnny Football for getting Bush his Heisman back.

AnimalA10 said:

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agnerd said:

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Guess I'm the only one that doesn't think he should get it back. He broke the rules, he knew he broke the rules, he decided it was worth the risk of getting caught, he got caught, and then thinks the consequences shouldn't apply to him.

I didn't meet the lofty GPA requirements of one of my college scholarships. I guess I need to start a PR campaign on how I DESERVE to have that scholarship money given to me even though I didn't hold up my end of the bargain.

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This, slap in the face to all the athletes who did follow the rules.

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The assumption shamateuridm creates corruption free competition on the field is very close to universally false. But there is always D3 where the virtue signalers should flee AND be chintzy at the same time!!!!